AB5 and CLSA

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Peter Ehlert
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby Peter Ehlert » Tue Feb 04, 2020 1:21 pm

DWoolley wrote:
dedkad wrote:One thing that I didn't see mentioned in the article above is how AB5 can negatively impact traffic safety. Uber and Lyft are great alternatives to people who have had too much to drink during a night on the town. Do we really want to send the drunks back home in their own cars?


We have an elderly friend that uses Uber for her doctor's appointments, grocery shopping, etc - her adult children are oftentimes unavailable during the weekdays. It will be interesting to see how it pans out for the ride sharing companies (technology platforms).

DWoolley


same here in Ensenada. Lots of family members don't own cars, they don't need them much.
Uber services and the like are Very handy for the occasions where walking or public transit will not serve.

The BIG problem is the Taxi companies lobbying to have them outlawed. Monopoly is not a fun game to play.
Peter Ehlert

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Sat Feb 08, 2020 10:25 am

So while everyone else is lobbying to overturn the impact of AB5 upon them - and with success I might add - the surveying industry (no longer a professions apparently), is silent. No effort is being made to send a letter or take a position on this important matter.

How unfortunate.

All it would take is a few phone calls and a few letters.

https://www.latimes.com/business/story/ ... ce-writers
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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Sat Feb 08, 2020 10:48 am

According to the article:

"Gonzalez introduced AB 1850 in early January as placeholder legislation to correct and clarify AB 5. Gonzalez, who has met with various critics of the law since its enactment, said she plans to introduce changes for musicians, fine artists, small businesses and others in coming months.

"Freelancers worried that under AB 5’s restrictions publishers would stop working with them rather than convert them to employees, as advocates of the law intended. In December, two groups representing freelance writers and photographers filed a lawsuit in federal court in Los Angeles alleging that AB 5 unconstitutionally restricts free speech and the media.

"The freelancers are just one of several groups that have pushed back against the new law. The California Trucking Assn. filed a lawsuit last year arguing that it hurt their ability to provide services. In December, U.S. District Judge Roger Benitez of San Diego granted a temporary exemption for independent truck drivers. Last month, a Los Angeles County Superior Court judge ruled the law does not apply to thousands of independent truck drivers because AB 5 is preempted by federal law."

BirdonaWire
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby BirdonaWire » Mon Feb 24, 2020 2:36 pm

This bill would also exempt timber operators, registered forest professionals, geologists and geophysicists, and land surveyors who meet certain statutory licensing requirements.

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/face ... =Geologist

Bird

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Warren Smith
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby Warren Smith » Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:17 am

AB 2572 was referred to the Committee on Labor and Employment yesterday.with a provision (8) (D) for the exemption of Land Surveyors.
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Warren D. Smith, LS 4842
County Surveyor
Tuolumne County

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:17 am

Thanks! So has CLSA and its membership started lobbying for passage of the exemption bill?

Has a phone tree been established?

Has a form letter been developed?

Has an email chain and list of committee members been circulated so the membership can weigh in?

Are any efforts being made by CLSA to support the exemption?

If not - why not?

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DWoolley
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby DWoolley » Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:06 am

The bill was introduced 12 days ago. Reminder, CLSA meets quarterly. The last meeting was three weeks before the bill was introduced. The next quarterly meeting is in April. CLSA cannot act without the approval from the Board of Directors.

The answer to all questions posed in the previous post is simply "no". The association is not wired to function in 12, 30, 60 or 90 days in most instances. The Executive Committee, rightfully, is also limited as to their authority to act in between board meetings.

CLSA members may choose to reach out to their chapter directors and get on the CLSA agenda for the next meeting. The agenda items will be due in Central Office by the end of March. For the ambitious, contact your legislators and be willing to testify at the committee meetings.

Lastly, if you are not affiliated with a chapter or have no relationship with your CLSA directors. Please contact Joe Padilla, Orange County Director Whip and he will provide any members with assistance on an agenda item. Alternatively, members can email ocdirectors@oc-surveyors.org and the item will be placed on the CLSA agenda or an individual viewpoint will be discussed on your behalf.

DWoolley
Last edited by DWoolley on Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:20 am

Thanks!

With all due respect, I believe CLSA has the ability to mobilize in a day or two, especially in this day of electronic communications.

Someone should compile a list of the important committee members, with their address, phone numbers, and emails and a draft statement should be put together. That could be done by day's end, if not sooner.

As you say, there is no prohibition about speaking as individuals.

At a minimum, the member carrying the bill should be contacted. That could be done today.

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Steve Martin
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby Steve Martin » Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:31 am

Who is behind AB2572?

Was that you Bird?

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:13 am

There is a mass effort underway to repeal AB5. I am sending a letter of support to the primary authors of the related legislation. This is a wonderful opportunity to participate in the democratic process and unify to protect our profession. Let's stand up and make a statement. Get off the sidelines and act now, today. You have a voice; please use it!

Here is the letter I am sending and faxing:
*******************************************************************************

Support of SB 806
An individual letter and fax, where available, will be sent to the following senators.
******************************************************************

Senator Shannon Grove
State Capitol, Room 305
Sacramento, CA 95814
Phone: (916) 651-4016
Fax: (916) 651-4916

Senator Pat Bates
State Capitol, Room 3048
Sacramento, California 95814
Phone: (916) 651-4036
Fax: (916) 651-4936

Senator Andreas Borgeas
State Capitol, Room 3082
Sacramento, CA 95814
Phone: (916) 651-4008
Fax: (916) 651-4908

Senator Ling Ling Chang
State Capitol, Room 4062
Sacramento, CA 95814
Phone: (916) 651-4029

Senator Brian Dahle
State Capitol, Room 2054
Sacramento, CA 95814
Phone: (916) 651-4001
Fax: (916) 651-4901

Senator Brian Jones
State Capitol, Room 4088
Sacramento, CA 95814
Phone: (916) 651-4038
Fax: (916) 651-4938

Senator John M. W. Moorlach
State Capitol, Room 2048
Sacramento, CA 95814
Phone: (916) 651-4037
Fax: (916) 651-4937

Senator Mike Morrell
State Capitol, Room 3056
Sacramento, CA 95814
Phone: 916.651.4023
Fax: 916.651.4923

Senator Jim Nielsen
State Capitol, Room 5064
Sacramento, CA 95814
Phone: (916) 651-4004
Fax: (916) 651-4904

Senator Scott Wilk
State Capitol, Room 3063
Sacramento, CA 95814
Phone: (916) 651-4021
Fax: (916) 651-4921
****************************************************************************************
Re: SB 806 – Repeal of AB5
Dear Ladies and Gentlemen of the California Senate,

I am writing you to support SB 806, repealing AB5. I am a Geomatics Engineer, also known as a Professional Land Surveyor, licensed in the State of California. Licensed Land Surveyors serve a vital role to the citizens of California. We measure and locate land as well as subdividing property for new homes. This work includes creating condominium units and recording condominium maps, usually in urban areas.
In order to perform our work, we need maximum flexibility as much of our work is seasonal and often, full-time employment is not available. Most land surveys are performed in the spring and summer months to avoid inclement weather as well as to take advantage of clear skies for aerial mapping, photogrammetry, and GPS mapping.

AB5 creates significant problems for Land Surveyors in that it is not uncommon for a field crew to work for several firms or, depending on workload, for one firm over an extended period of time. This business model is one that has been in place since the days when George Washington and Abraham Lincoln were Land Surveyors.

It goes without saying that it is already a challenge to operate a small business in California. Furthermore, the application of AB5 to Land Surveyors is entirely inconsistent with the exemptions granted to Civil Engineers as both professions are licensed by the California Board for Professional Engineers, Land Surveyors, and Geologists. Civil Engineers and Geomatic Engineers are recognized professionals and should be treated in the same manner and subject to the same rules and laws. After all, is that not why professionals are licensed?

As a constituent, consumer, and licensed professional, I am in complete support of your efforts to repeal AB5. It is a flawed piece of legislation, hastily adopted, and incompatible with conducting a business in this great state of ours.
I appreciate your efforts and willingness to repeal a bad piece of legislation.

Sincerely,


Michael J. Pallamary, PLS
California Licensed Land Surveyor 4830

**************************************************************
https://chang.cssrc.us/content/senator- ... worker-law

https://wilk.cssrc.us/content/wilk-anno ... ournalists

https://morrell.cssrc.us/content/legisl ... worker-law

https://jones.cssrc.us/content/senator- ... killer-law

https://borgeas.cssrc.us/content/senato ... -town-hall
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LS_8750
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby LS_8750 » Thu Mar 05, 2020 10:25 am

Why those senators?
Please pardon my ignorance.

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Thu Mar 05, 2020 11:30 am

They are identified as co-sponsors of the bill. Please review the pdf I attached previously as "SB 806 regarding AB5.pdf."

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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby Danielle Goshert » Thu Mar 05, 2020 11:53 am

Thank you, Michael.

I also recommend that Assembly Member Lorena Gonzalez, author of AB5, be copied on all correspondence.

Assembly Member Lorena Gonzalez
Capitol Office, Room 2114
P.O. Box 942849
Sacramento, CA 94249-0080
(916) 319-2080
Danielle L. Goshert
Napa County Surveyor

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:04 pm

Thanks! Great idea!

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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:18 pm

Wouldn't it be wonderful if the state association and all its members took this opportunity to participate in the direction our profession is headed as well as to stand up and say something and, be heard?

As the tide is already in motion, this is a unique opportunity to shape our future. When is the last time CLSA rallied behind anything like this? When have we had the opportunity to reach out to our legislators to let them know a little bit about what we do as well as educating them on the importance of our work? As the old saying goes:

"There Are Three Types of People: Those Who Make Things Happen, Those Who Watch Things Happen, and Those Who Wonder What Happened."

Who are you?

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:33 pm

Imagine if the association sent out an email blast to the membership on this? We have the names and addresses of the important members who have co-authored the eradication legislation. It would take ten minutes for every land surveyor to send and fax a letter.

Imagine how impressive such an effort would make on the legislative members, especially if the letters and faxes were sent on Monday, in a coordinated effort!

There is only one way to get something done and that is to act.

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David Kendall
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby David Kendall » Thu Mar 05, 2020 3:52 pm

It seems to me that the wiser move would be to support the AB 2572 over the SB 806. I like the odds more

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Thu Mar 05, 2020 3:56 pm

Great! Support them both!

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Thu Mar 05, 2020 4:15 pm

David. Did you send a letter or fax or both?

Danielle Goshert
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby Danielle Goshert » Fri Mar 06, 2020 8:39 am

I found the attached summary of pending legislation, court rulings, and initiatives pertaining to AB5 incredibly helpful (and hyperlinked, no less!). I obtained this document through the Facebook group 'Freelancers Against AB5'; this group is a great resource for information and they are trying to facilitate an organized campaign of opposition. Many different occupations are voicing their displeasure with this legislation and I am certain that our voices are a welcome addition.
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Danielle L. Goshert
Napa County Surveyor

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David Kendall
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby David Kendall » Fri Mar 06, 2020 9:13 am

mpallamary wrote:David. Did you send a letter or fax or both?

Mr Pallamary-

While I do not share your passion or sense of urgency for the repeal of AB5 nor do I feel it is a cause worthy of CLSA action, I am willing to write a letter in support of your campaign, mostly out of solidarity.

I do not, however see the value of mailing a letter of support to the makers of this bill. It appears to me that they are already aligned in support. Therefore, one would, as they say, be preaching to the choir.

It would seem a more profitable endeavor for interested activists to send letters of support to their local Senators, to whom they would be constituents.

I presume that the purpose of the CLSA legislative committee is to help us create movements such as this but without pulling in opposite directions and thus floundering or working against each other.

With your extensive legislative experience, do you agree with this last assertion?

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Fri Mar 06, 2020 10:22 am

HI,

Thanks for replying. I respectfully disagree. In order for an engine to run it needs fuel. Politicians are fed by support and letters and faxes and phone calls to survive. Every letter and vocal support validates their position and they are comforted with the knowledge others agree and support them. It is like the recent elections. Once you declare a platform, the way it is validated is when people vote for you.

I also hope folks would send a letter to their senators. You are absolutely correct. CLSA should have (had) a list in circulation telling everyone who their senator is. These are the kind of mobilization efforts CLSA can do. They have membership names and addresses. People should know that on the natural.

There is also merit and great strength in mobilizing a community/profession as that, in and of itself can be empowering.

In short, one can either act or watch.

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Fri Mar 06, 2020 10:31 am

Danielle Goshert wrote:I found the attached summary of pending legislation, court rulings, and initiatives pertaining to AB5 incredibly helpful (and hyperlinked, no less!). I obtained this document through the Facebook group 'Freelancers Against AB5'; this group is a great resource for information and they are trying to facilitate an organized campaign of opposition. Many different occupations are voicing their displeasure with this legislation and I am certain that our voices are a welcome addition.


Thanks Danielle!

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Fri Mar 06, 2020 10:35 am

From my perspective and having been a director going back from the period of 30 to 40 years ago. (1980s through 1990s), there is no reason the Executive Board cannot, at a minimum send a letter of support for one or more pieces of the legislation. All it takes is a quick conference call and a decision. It has been done before.

The Central office can compile a list of the chapters and who their senators are. That should take an hour or so.

If there is a will, there is a way.

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mpallamary
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Re: AB5 and CLSA

Postby mpallamary » Fri Mar 06, 2020 10:36 am

As to Danielle's comments, unless we speak up, we have no voice. We cannot be heard if we do not speak.


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